Author Topic: Plating and solid armor  (Read 6615 times)

Hyperion

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Plating and solid armor
« on: January 13, 2012, 03:47:46 pm »
I want to address and issue with the plating system. Lightweight aluminum frames are impractical for amoring a ship. As it stands right now making your hull thicker actually makes you weaker, once the outside plated block gets destroyed all of the blocks behind it do not have any inherent armor and thus become easy targets for penetrating weapons. Would it be possible to make the armor solid blocks instead and use the plating system for painting the ship? It would allow us to make the amor layer of the ship a lot thinner and less complex than it is now.
I don't want to go "Oh! there's shots going my way! No big deal I'm the U.S.S Bloody Massive, It won't even leave a scratch." *boom* "SHIT! BIG DEAL! HUGE DEAL!"

theallmightybob

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2012, 03:48:58 pm »
I want to address and issue with the plating system. Lightweight aluminum frames are impractical for amoring a ship. As it stands right now making your hull thicker actually makes you weaker, once the outside plated block gets destroyed all of the blocks behind it do not have any inherent armor and thus become easy targets for penetrating weapons. Would it be possible to make the armor solid blocks instead and use the plating system for painting the ship? It would allow us to make the amor layer of the ship a lot thinner and less complex than it is now.

if you want thicker armour you have to layer it with air spaces. it will give you more then one armour surface.
would you buy a toaster shaped like an f22 with an eject button on it? cause thats what i'm going for.

Hyperion

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2012, 03:55:18 pm »
I know that. Still plating isn't practical really, not for combat. The dev team has said that any blocks not connected with your ship would float away. The armor layer of the ship if laid out in a checkerboard patter more than two meters thick will float away. If those blocks are connected with rest of the ship which they will have to be around protrusions like engines and viewports the connected blocks become weakpoint. If a frame block became exposed to the outside of the ship it allows weapons to destroy it with no resistance and keep going into the rest of the ship.
I don't want to go "Oh! there's shots going my way! No big deal I'm the U.S.S Bloody Massive, It won't even leave a scratch." *boom* "SHIT! BIG DEAL! HUGE DEAL!"

theallmightybob

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2012, 04:03:20 pm »
stagger inturnal struts to prevent fire through. I have a feeling that armour is going to be less of a concern once we get shielding, but thats just a guess. brining the solid hull block back to use as durable single block thick beams might be nice.
would you buy a toaster shaped like an f22 with an eject button on it? cause thats what i'm going for.

Zerebo

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2012, 04:05:26 pm »
The armour system right now got really some problems.
Two hits at the same position can destroy whole lines of armour. Because when you hit the frame of the armour, the armour is destroyed.
Also it looks weird when armour is just a texture on a frame.

One solution could be to make an armoured frame armoured on all sides. (Also where it's connected to other frames)
Yeah basically a solid block but still with the option to plate something else on the inside of it.




theallmightybob

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2012, 04:08:32 pm »
I rember someone was talking about this before, and i liked the Idea someone had of minecraft like half blocks that act as armour and can be layered ontop of eachother. you coul deven have a few detail blocks like wedges and ramps that could give your ship a smooth look. it would also make armoring utility lines and systems alot easier.
would you buy a toaster shaped like an f22 with an eject button on it? cause thats what i'm going for.

Viken

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2012, 04:30:15 pm »
The current 'Frame' system is here to stay. There's no getting around that.  But at the moment, there isn't any balancing on the weapons and armour ratings.  That will be changed, although probably not for a while.  The current build of BR has it that way so that it can be simple and still playable, but it won't be the final.

Mwhahaha.  8)
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Zerebo

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2012, 04:33:08 pm »
Halve blocks sounds good but probably produces strange results at edges and makes ship constructing harder.
At least when you do them in Minecraft style.

I think a good solution could be:
-Plating a frame makes it automatically a halve block armour.
The opposite side of the armour could be still used for every other plating stuff.
-Plating it on 2 sides makes it a solid block armour.

This way you have nearly the same system for the user but with much better working armour.
Also it looks better when armour and other plated stuff got actually a thickness when you look from the side.

But I'm sure the devs already planned a better armour system.


Hyperion

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2012, 04:52:14 pm »
I think plating should be more like painting a block. Armor blocks would function the same as frame blocks, they would just be a different texture with improved durability. The devs have mentioned that in the future frame blocks might be able to run utilities through them, well there would still be a use for frame blocks as armor blocks wouldn't have utilities running through them. You could keep the armor plate for those starfighters where space is at a premium, with important utilities running through them frames still need some form of protection if the bulky armor blocks weren't an option.

EDIT: With painting similar to laying plates, frame blocks behind the paint would be unprotected and thus a prime target for attack.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 04:54:04 pm by AmberWolf »
I don't want to go "Oh! there's shots going my way! No big deal I'm the U.S.S Bloody Massive, It won't even leave a scratch." *boom* "SHIT! BIG DEAL! HUGE DEAL!"

SnowDragon

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2012, 06:59:44 pm »
Keep your frame system, we're cool with that. We'd just like to also have the old system of solid blocks of hull, except that they be solid blocks of armour with more resistance than straight plating at the exense of being stupid heavy.

Hyperion

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2012, 07:00:57 pm »
Couldn't have said it better myself SnowDragon.
I don't want to go "Oh! there's shots going my way! No big deal I'm the U.S.S Bloody Massive, It won't even leave a scratch." *boom* "SHIT! BIG DEAL! HUGE DEAL!"

Jmanndriver

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2012, 08:17:19 pm »
I see them eventually making the plating pieces entities themselves. So for example if a piece of plating is destroyed next to another and the frame of the one next to it is destroyed it will still have the plating floating over the hole. There could be some reduction in it's effectiveness since it has less support to compensate for the loss of the frame.

We could also have it to where you have the option to have hull blocks, such as in previous updates, which are just frames completely encased in the hull of your choosing.

The biggest problem is that when you look at many of the ships in movies they have a hull that is layered. With the current system we can't stack more and more plate on top of each other. We can however upgrade to heavy which should, in future updates, absorb much more damage than lighter plating.

In the end we still need the frame if and only if it will be used to spread conduits and wires throughout the ship.


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Cruxador

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2012, 05:32:14 pm »
I like the plating system. Snowdragon's compromise (Just have both!) is a good one though. For truly immense ships it would make sense that there would be block-thick or even multi-block armor on critical areas.

Niwantaw

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2012, 06:23:47 pm »
I like the plating system. Snowdragon's compromise (Just have both!) is a good one though. For truly immense ships it would make sense that there would be block-thick or even multi-block armor on critical areas.

I multi layer already on anything over 200m...
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SnowDragon

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Re: Plating and solid armor
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2012, 07:46:39 pm »
Heck, you should see the planned armour thickness of SH, even without shields... :P